Original author: TechFlow
Even though there are thousands of waves, the red beans are blooming towards the sun!
Once upon a time, Azuki was a brilliant dream in the hearts of many NFT enthusiasts and a proud display of social identity. Later, the NFT market fell into silence, and Azuki also faced many challenges and doubts.
Today, Azuki founder Zagabond is back on stage with Animecoin and his dream of an anime universe, facing controversy head-on.
On January 23, ANIME (Animecoin) will be officially launched.
After collecting questions from several Azuki community members, TechFlow conducted an exclusive interview with Zagabond.
Zagabond believes that there is a huge gap between how he is seen by those around him and the assumptions of those who have never met him. A persons character is not defined by the opinions of strangers on the Internet, but by how you consistently treat those who are important to you.
Finally, Zagabond called out to the community, Azukis strength comes from our passion and creativity. We have built something very special here. Were on our way.
About Zagabond
TechFlow: What was your career like before founding Azuki? What made you enter the Web3/NFT field?
Zagabond:
My journey began in China, and I came to Germany when I was six years old. That was my first experience of being an outsider. As the only Chinese child in kindergarten and not speaking German at the time, I remember speaking to my classmates in Chinese and not understanding why they couldn’t understand me.
This early isolation, combined with seven different schools in multiple countries, helped me adapt quickly to new situations—even if it also made me cautious about making deep connections. By the time my family finally settled on Long Island, New York, I had developed a fierce independence and resilience.
My passion for the digital world began with the MMORPG game RuneScape, where I discovered my fascination with the digital economy. Rather than focusing on traditional gameplay, I was drawn to the marketplace and became addicted to collecting rare items like blue party hats - a foreshadowing of my future interest in digital assets and NFTs. Similarly, Pokémon showed me how strong IP can span multiple mediums while building passionate communities through collectibles and storytelling.
When I discovered Ethereum in 2016, I immediately recognized its potential as an open, programmable blockchain to host the digital economy. This prompted me to join 0x Protocol as a founding team member in 2017, and together we built decentralized trading infrastructure. I participated in early discussions in which we coined the term DeFi, which later became the category name for mainstream crypto protocols.
After four years of working in the DeFi space, I saw an opportunity to combine the decentralized principles of cryptocurrency with the community-building power of NFTs. This vision, combining the digital economy with brand building, became the cornerstone of Azuki, and we are committed to bringing innovation to the anime industry through a decentralized IP approach.
TechFlow: Why did you choose the name Zagabond? Whats the story behind this name?
Zagabond:
Zagabond is inspired by Vagabond, a classic manga by Takehiko Inoue that tells the life story of Japanese swordsman Miyamoto Musashi. The manga’s deep philosophical themes of self-discovery and the meaning of life resonate strongly with me.
I considered several other pseudonyms at the time, but I remember listening to one of my favorite songs, Feather, by Nujabes, and hearing these lyrics:
Im just a Vagabond with Flowers for Algernon An Average Joe who knows what the fuck is going on
That’s when I decided on the name Zagabond.
TechFlow: Why did you choose to launch Azuki anonymously at first, and then choose to make your identity public? What happened in between?
Zagabond:
One of my favorite designers is Margiela, he was a fashion designer who never showed his face. He always stayed behind the scenes and let his designs speak for themselves.
When I started Azuki, I saw it as a way to express myself. I didnt want my appearance or background to affect how the audience felt about the art and brand I was creating.
I remember walking into Azuki’s first NFT LA event and standing in the middle of the party looking around at all the holders having a blast. No one knew who I was. But I felt so happy and at peace seeing the community members having the time of their lives.
As Azuki grew and we began to make progress in the anime industry, I felt the need to make myself more public. Eventually, it was time to put a real face to the name, show the community that there was a real person behind Zagabond, participate in more interviews and live events - so that I could lead the field towards my vision of Anime 2.0 with honesty and transparency.
TechFlow: In your opinion, what is the biggest misunderstanding about you?
Zagabond:
The biggest misconception people have about me is that I’m primarily driven by self-interest, but that couldn’t be further from the truth.
What really drives me is a deep belief in building an open anime universe through Azuki and Animecoin. After eight years in crypto, I am lucky enough to have achieved financial freedom - I dont have to work at all, let alone in such a demanding field. But I would deeply regret not pursuing this vision in my best years.
Being a crypto founder isn’t always glamorous. It means constant pressure, trolling on social media, and needing to adapt to rapidly changing trends. I’ve made significant personal sacrifices for this role. But I stick with it because I love creating extraordinary things with extraordinary people — that’s what Azuki garden is all about.
There is a huge mismatch between who I am as a person by those who know me — my friends, team, and the Azuki community — and the assumptions of those who have never met me. I am in this space because I am passionate about innovation and bringing creative minds together to build revolutionary things.
TechFlow: In your opinion, how have you changed compared to who you were two years ago? When was the last time you completely changed your opinion?
Zagabond:
Watching people spread misinformation about me online over the years has given me a strange kind of freedom—its taught me whats truly important.
I know who I am, and the people closest to me know it, too. Thats enough. Character isnt defined by the opinions of strangers on the internet - its defined by how you consistently treat the people who matter. I stayed with the community through every high and low because I truly cared about every member. Thats all that mattered.
About Elementals Controversy and Community Sentiment
TechFlow: In 2023, Azuki launched the Elementals series, which caused great controversy and pushed the communitys dissatisfaction to its peak. Looking back, do you think the Elementals series was a failed attempt to hurt the communitys feelings? Do you regret it?
Zagabond:
Azuki Elementals represents our vision to expand the Azuki universe, aiming to create a more accessible entry point into the garden. We have achieved something unprecedented with Elementals - it remains the most exquisite hand-painted PFP series to date, with an artistic complexity and combination of features that has yet to be matched.
The core strategy of expanding accessibility to the Azuki ecosystem was sound, and we have seen validation of this through the vibrant new community members that Elementals has brought to the table. However, our execution, especially in marketing and communications, could have been better. We used to maintain a sense of mystery and surprise when launching products, but the space has become more mature.
Elementals taught us valuable lessons about transparency and expectation management. While I personally still believe that the decision to expand the Azuki universe was the right one, we have evolved our approach to better meet the communitys needs for clear communication and engagement.
TechFlow: Elementals was issued and a total of 20,000 ETH was obtained. Where was the money mainly spent?
Zagabond:
All revenue generated by the company is invested back into furthering our vision of creating an open anime universe.
We have built an amazing team of 45 people. We are very selective in our hiring - we look for people who not only have amazing skills, but are also passionate about web3 and anime.
These funds will be critical to developing high-quality products and experiences that showcase the possibilities of Web3. We have made great progress in establishing Azuki as the leading anime brand in the space, while making anime.com the true home for anime fans around the world.
TechFlow: In addition to the Elementals incident, in May 2022, you admitted that you had participated in other failed NFT projects (such as Tendies, CryptoZunks), which shook many holders trust in you. Two years have passed. Do you think you have rebuilt the trust relationship with the community? What efforts have you made in this regard?
Zagabond:
Let me respond to this question directly: Prior to Azuki, I did launch three experimental NFT projects - Phunks, Tendies, and Zunks. While I completed all of the functionality promised by these projects, I recognize that the way I handled the project transitions could have been more professional and transparent. As a result, I returned all of the proceeds from these projects to their respective communities.
Since acknowledging this in May 2022, I have been fully focused on the development of Azuki. The growth of Azuki from a PFP project to a globally recognized anime brand is a reflection not only of my personal commitment, but also of the strength of our entire team and community. Azuki represents my long-term vision and dedication to building something truly meaningful in this space.
About ANIME Token
TechFlow: After Pudgy Penguins launched PENGU and achieved success, Azuki also announced the launch of ANIME tokens. Is this following the market trend? How do you ensure that ANIME tokens can bring substantial value to the ecosystem, rather than simply chasing the trend?
Zagabond:
$ANIME is a cultural token for the anime community, aiming to revolutionize the anime industry into a community-driven creative network. The Animecoin Foundation announced the birth of the Animecoin project as early as March 2024, which has been in preparation for nearly a year.
TechFlow: In the official website, ANIME is defined as a cultural token. How do you understand cultural tokens? What are ANIMEs long-term goals and visions?
Zagabond:
Anime has evolved from a subculture to become part of mainstream pop culture. Luxury brands like Chanel and Burberry are partnering with anime brands, athletes are mentioning anime in post-game interviews, and rappers like Megan Thee Stallion are using anime soundtracks.
However, despite the global influence that anime has achieved, there are still some major structural problems in the anime industry. On the fan side, although they have invested heavily in cryptocurrencies, there is no proper fan loyalty and consumption attribution mechanism. On the creator side, due to the special financing structure of Japanese anime, many animators and IP holders do not have a significant income.
We believe there is a unique opportunity here, which we call Anime 2.0. Crypto can revolutionize the anime fan experience by integrating these decentralized fan components on-chain, enabling IP holders to accurately measure the depth of their fan base and unlock new revenue opportunities by monetizing a more engaged fan base.
To support Anime 2.0, our strategy involves what we call “Full Stack Anime”:
The strategy aims to create a flywheel effect, with each component driving the growth of the others. By seamlessly integrating blockchain infrastructure, consumer platforms, and IP, Full Stack Animation ensures that the network becomes increasingly valuable and self-sustaining as more users and developers join. It consists of three parts:
Blockchain Infrastructure: Animechain is a L3 blockchain using Arbitrum Orbit technology, with Animecoin as a custom fuel token. This setup simplifies the experience for Web2 anime fans; they only need to understand and purchase Animecoin, reducing the complexity of managing multiple tokens while allowing gas-free (sponsorship) transactions for seamless onboarding.
Anime.com: Bringing in web2 users through consumer products is critical to triggering a flywheel effect of increasing value. A large user base attracts more teams to build on the network, which in turn brings in more users. Anime.com aims to do what Discord did for gaming - become the dominant social layer for the entire anime industry.
Content and IP: IP development creates the foundation for the cultural energy that drives the entire technology stack. IP is the layer that ties the pieces together, unifying the community’s passion for Animecoin.
TechFlow: According to the token economics that have been released, 37.5% of the tokens will be allocated to the Azuki community, 13% will be used for AnimeDAO, 24.44% will be allocated to the Animecoin Foundation, 2% will be allocated to the cooperative community, 15.62% will be allocated to the team and consultants, and 7.44% will be used for Azuki company. In other words, 60.5% of the token chips have returned to the hands of Azuki officials. What are the considerations for such token chip distribution?
Zagabond:
I’ve seen some misunderstandings/misinformation about the token economics that seem to imply that 60.5% of the token allocation is controlled by Azuki - this is false.
The Animecoin Foundation is an independent, memberless entity (i.e., it does not have any shareholders) and is not affiliated with Azuki. No one on the Azuki team, including me, is a shareholder (again, the Animecoin Foundation has no shareholders), director, employee, or other controller of the Animecoin Foundation. It has its own board of directors, advisors, and service providers. The Animecoin Foundation is the steward that facilitates the AnimeDAO governance process. It is also the dedicated entity that drives growth for the ecosystem and will use its allocation to fund launch and ongoing operations, grant programs, and other initiatives that connect Animecoin and the broader anime ecosystem. The Animecoin Foundations token allocation will be held in its own multi-signature wallet, which Azuki is not a signatory to/does not have control over.
The 13% of tokens allocated to AnimeDAO will be used and deployed solely through the decisions of ANIME holders, in accordance with the governance process. These tokens will be held in a separate DAO Treasury multi-signature wallet, which the Animecoin Foundation will control and Azuki is not a signatory/has no control. These tokens can only be used based on governance proposals voted in by AnimeDAO.
TechFlow: When the tokens are released, 76.94% of the tokens will be fully unlocked, of which 37.44% will come from the Animecoin Foundation and AnimeDAO. Will this part flow into the market? Why is the TGE unlocking ratio designed to be so high?
Zagabond:
As mentioned above, the 13% of tokens allocated to AnimeDAO will be used and deployed solely through the decisions of ANIME holders, in accordance with the governance process. I cannot predict what initiatives will be proposed and approved by AnimeDAO, but generally governance processes take time, and tokens spent by DAOs often take time before they actually enter circulation (e.g., initiatives funded by DAO grants often need to reach milestones before they can actually be distributed to grantees).
Regarding the Animecoin Foundation, in addition to funding launch operations (i.e. the various service providers and partners that support any token launch), similar to the above point, grants administered by the Foundation to develop the ecosystem may also come with milestones that will take time before actually entering circulation.
TechFlow: In March 2024, Arbitrum Foundation announced that it would co-create AnimeChain with Azuki. What is the relationship between Azuki NFT, AnimeChain, and Animecoin?
Zagabond:
First of all, it should be made clear that Animechain was not created by the Arbitrum Foundation nor by Azuki. The Animecoin Foundation is not only the manager of Animecoin, but also the entity leading the development of Animechain.
Azuki is a core contributor to the Animecoin Foundation, supporting the Animecoin Foundation in its mission to manage the development and growth of the Animecoin ecosystem.
TechFlow: After the token issuance, where will you and the Animecoin Foundation invest your energy and money? What are the major strategic plans?
Zagabond:
I can’t speak for the Animecoin Foundation as to where exactly it will allocate its resources, but its sole mission is to support the growth of the Animecoin ecosystem, and it has its own team and service providers to help achieve that goal.
As for Azuki, our main focus will be executing the full-stack anime strategy described above.
About the Future of NFT
TechFlow: NFT has experienced highs and lows in the past few years, from simple PFP and social currency to the current NFT having to rely on a public chain or an actual project. A large number of NFTs have issued tokens and seem to have become vassals of Tokens. What do you think is the future development trend of NFT?
Zagabond:
NFTs can be a lot of different things. I actually dont like to think of NFT as a single category because the use cases for NFTs can be very different. Regardless, its clear that NFTs are one of the best tools for building communities and are here to stay.
TechFlow: As a global project, how do Azuki and Animecoin balance the needs of users in different regions? What is the development strategy in the Asian market in particular?
Zagabond:
The Asia Pacific region is an extremely important region for both Azuki and Animecoin. Considering Azuki’s art style is derived from Japanese anime, we have always had a strong connection with the Asia Pacific market.
We are investing resources in building our presence in the Asia Pacific region, including establishing a world-class business development team in Japan to penetrate the animation industry.
TechFlow: Finally, what would you like to say to the Azuki community members?
Zagabond:
Azukis strength stems from our passion and creativity, which are key to our success. We also see a strong representation of these values in our community and are grateful for their support. Anyone who joins the Garden can talk about how unique our culture is. I think we have built something very special here, and my goal is to lead us to mainstream Web2 adoption and represent Web3 in the right way. Were on our way.
